But, in short, if you've got a 120mm fan based radiator setup planned then likely you'll end up with the Noctua A12x25 as a good push/pull, push, or pull choice (I keep hearing that the black ones are supposed to be coming soon...). The difference between push and pull is very small. I wouldn't recommend adding more fans to make it push pull. By using our Services or clicking I agree, you agree to our use of cookies. I feel just a push or pull is enough to sustain great temps but with higher rpms, but I was wondering if a person has high rpm fans that preformed great at high rpms would it be wrong to think that setting up push and pull for the 2 - 240 rads will allow me to get same performance with lower rpms. With that exact cooler, you wont see a big difference in push vs. pull. To clean it you have to take the fans off. Several fans have dead zones in the center that are fairly large in push configuration. Neve had any mechanical noise issues in push pull for years as fan quality is decent these days, last buzzers/grinders I had were some EK fans. Id like it to be more of a discussion with thoughts about this, there is no true answer to this and I'm willing to accept that but I love trying new configurations and maybe I'll get more cooling due to a pull over a push! Really isnt worth it. When you have a pull config you get dust on the opposite side of the radiator from the fans. I always use water cooling but push VS pull often depends on where you're getting the air from and the type of fan. Well when they get noisey from obstruction they're definitely louder than 30db as a result. It looks really similar to the pump on the previous ML240L RGB at first glance, but you can immediately notice the difference in height between both pumps if it’s compared side by side – the ML240L V2 RGB pump is visibly taller than the ML240L RGB. So less noise for the same cooling or better cooling for the same noise/RPM. Push vs Pull. Rule of thumb for pumps: Push, don't pull. These fans compete directly with each other and are really good performers, in my opinion. Always use the right shroud with your fan. Other than that when shopping for fans choose the ones that have lower decibel output while maintaining good CFM. Probably not even push/pull with a good air flow fan. :h34r-smiPhanteks Owners Club:h34r-smiWays to Better Cooling :h34r-smii7 980 @ 3.55GHz =PH-TC14PE w/2x TY-143 fans =Crucial Ballistix 3x4GB =GA-X58A-UD5 =ASUS GTX580 DirectCU II =Enermax Modu84+ =Define R2 w/3x TY-140 case intake fans; all PWM controlled by CPU fan socket:h34r-smiPhanteks Enthoo Primo MoBo Rampage III Extreme CPUi7 980X @ 4.0GHz =R1 … Not much power in sucking it up. Unless your radiator is really think 60mm+, it's not restricting the fan. When a vehicle is moving, a pusher fan can obstruct airflow due to its positioning in front of the radiator. Tested push/pull with 2 different fans Discussion I was told that having 2 different fans in a push pull setup was not going to work as well as regular push fans, because of something to do with the pulses caused by the fan blades getting out of sync. If you had an average 10c water to air delta, that would equal about 3C. Fans move air through the radiator assisting in cooling the engine. If you want to know about positive case pressure, just do a search. When I look at the Noctua A12x25 fans, in reviews with or without their new tower cooler, I'm very curious about them because even though they've got a lower static pressure rating than either of those two mentioned fans, above, they're supposedly just really pleasant sounding at higher RPMs negating any need for higher static pressure fans in push that are buzzy and annoying at half the rated RPM to begin with. Oh and a Push/Pull configuration can be better than just a pull or push. Push pull would benefit more if it was the monsta size (like 80mm) 60mm thick, you could get away with just push. As mentioned earlier, the ML240L V2 RGB is equipped with the latest 3rd generation dual-chamber pump by Cooler Master. 3. 2-26-15 Domain upgrade expired, this is the new permanent address. When I have those same 120mm iPPC's in pull, only, then they are much quieter and I can easily leave them at a ~1000RPM minimum (as I have in an a media server right now) without really hearing anything other than air (case depending). So an obvious question arises, “Is it better to use the fan to push fresh air into the unit to be cooled (positive pressure), or to put the fan on the exhaust side and pull heated air through and out of it (negative pressure) (see Figure 1)?” It seems like a simple-enough question, and … just got a 240mm Radiator water cooling closed loop and need to know ware is the best place to mount it in my case either on the front or on top of the case also which way should i have the fans push or pull if i put the radiator on the top or front on the case. Silent Wings 3 HS (and some others) in push, pull, and push/pull. At the end of each month, the mod team decides which builds have impressed them enough to make it into this gallery. New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast, More posts from the watercooling community, Press J to jump to the feed. Maybe 1C. You’ll see there are two distinct groups – the Push/Pull radiators from 76% up, and the push only group from 40-50% In other words ANY radiator with push/pull fans is significantly better than ANY radiator with push only fans at similar RPM. Part 2 clarified things about radiator performance, how radiator performance is expressed and how do we read radiator performance charts. View Entire Discussion (5 Comments) More posts from the watercooling community Option 1 is better, push or pull configuration doesn't affect temps at all but you want to put them to pull for easier radiator cleaning with regular vacuum cleaner. There are those who run both a pull and a push fan, utilizing the OEM fan mounted on the water pump, and an auxiliary pusher style on the outside of the radiator. 15 feet of water column is a loss of approximately 6 psi dead loss (out of 14.7 or so) before figuring any friction losses on the suction side. And adding a fan wont actually do anything, again, it might help by 1C. Read a review or two of the new DH-U12A to get an idea about how these fans perform/sound. Silent Wings 3 High Speed fans. As an aside, in my current build I've got three of my buzzy-boi 120mm iPPC fans pushing up through a 360x60mm radiator on the top of the case, but I've also got four 140mm iPPC fans in push/pull with a 280x60mm radiator in the front of the case. Also, I would recommend putting the fan in a pull configuration rather than push, as it makes it way easier to clean dust from the radiator. Unless your radiator is really think 60mm+, it's not restricting the fan. The Choice Gallery. I have put my hand on the output side of fans and heard the fans slow down. Hyper 212+ testing, Push vs Pull vs Push Pull; Also Horizontal vs Vertical positioning. You have the reservoir, the pump, the radiator, the fans, some tubing, a … Now the 140mm iPPC fans are miracles of engineering. Water cooling systems -- whether they are a custom loop or an AIO-- all follow the same basic principles. Directly comparable to the Noctua iPPC in static pressure. It's driving me crazy and I love this community,always good advice. This time 1300RPM Push/Pull vs 1400RPM Push: If you have the money, free fanheaders/splitters then go for push/pull. Looks like you do though. Electrical fans can either push air through the radiator or pull air through it. A push/pull is less than 10% more efficient than either a Push or a Pull configuration. That's a whole lot of the radiator (or heatsink for air cooling) that's not getting any air over it. So make sure you plan for that. More fans blowing in than out. Don't expect any crazy results from a push/pull configuration though, it's just a bit better than push, even though you are using twice the amount of fans. In comparison, I have a poor little Clarkdale i3-530 that I've overclocked to 4.2Ghz with a Scythe Fuma dual tower sporting two Bequiet! Read the Guides at the EKWB site for more information. New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast, More posts from the watercooling community, Press J to jump to the feed. Preference should be given to a "pull" vs. a "push" fan. Generally push plus pull or two pumps in series provides about a 30% flow gain. Neal: The majority of the time, if you're doing push-pull, the whole point isn't necessarily to get better cooling, it's to get the same cooling with less noise because you can turn the fans down. They explain why push cools better. Cookies help us deliver our Services. Silent wings (not the high speed ones) give me the quietest operation in push (and or) pull, and are easy enough to get hold of cheaply. I don't think push or pull really makes a difference to the cooling of the CPU, it has more to do with where the removed heat is directed after leaving the fan. Welcome to /r/Watercooling's choice gallery! This post doesn't have any useful information: https://www.reddit.com/r/watercooling/comments/4yr1mj/is_there_a_difference_between_push_and_pull_when/. All shrouded fans should be on the engine side of the radiator. I have built high performance water systems than run no more than 2-3 degree deltas. Opening out the back really shows the effect of an obstacle, even at some distance. Please excuse the broken menu system while I work on fixing the links. You do not ever want the fans pulling air from the inside of case to outside, as the air will be hotter inside the case vs outside. Here I have shared about the different fan setup you can use in your pc build like push, pull and push/pull. The air flow noise with push pull can be pretty loud though if you get fans that spin fast enough. Another thing we’d like to note, not related to the push-pull configurations is that Vardar fans do slightly better in pull configurations. Whenever I put the iPPCs in push, or have something like a grating in front of them to pull through, they just get unpleasant buzzing/buffeting at 1000 RPM, and up, that sounds almost like a bearing (thought it was first time I heard this). Keep in mind that the static pressure spec for these fans is like 4 mmH20 at 2000 RPM, but also only 30db at its max. Testing push vs pull vs push/pull. Op, best thing might be to test that before you mount everything in the case. Which do I recommend? This would mean using any extra fans in push/pull makes little difference as the air is already flowing easily enough, rendering the extra fans redundant. 30 fpi I would recommend a slim rad, like 27mm thick. You can muffle more sound by placing fans on the inside of the radiator mounted to the case. The air flow noise with push pull can be pretty loud though if you get fans that spin fast enough. Thanks. Time to continue the story about radiators for liquid cooling. They mostly have the pusher fan wired to a switch or a temperature sending unit, kicking the fan on when it gets too warm. If extra fans are available using them to make a push/pull configuration will result in the same temps using lower RPM. So just run it as is. I just recently bought a new case the Phantom 820, kraken x61 cpu watercooler, and and I7 I want to overclock. much easier to clean, and the same performance. Here's an episode that we've been asked to do for quite some time. It's discussed 100 times a month over at BAPC. If my goal is a fairly silent build, should I have my fans set up to push or pull air through the radiator on a liquid cooling setup? When you have a push config, the dust ends up between the radiator and fan. More importantly is having a higher amount of pressure in your case. Worse with the mentioned grating in front, though. However, I'll give you my experience with my 120mm Noctua iPPC fans and my Bequiet! This from a guy who drives out to his crossroads Roadhouse in a flathead-6 Ford pickup with crank-down windows to push quarters into a … A puller fan on the other hand sits right behind the radiator. A plow doesnt suck the dirt up to displace it. I would however always have the fan pull air from the outside of the case to inside. I wouldn't recommend adding more fans to make it push pull. TONS of people have asked me about fan configurations for radiators and heatsinks. Mounted on the engine side of the radiator, a pull fan does not interfere with airflow at highway speeds. I just wanted a little help and insight on to which method to use and what the flow of air in my case should be? Otherwise push is the way to go. ... both fans produced better cooling on pull alone than with push/pull or push alone. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. I'm very pleased with these, and, honestly, think I just need to move to all 140mm fan based radiators for my next build. Those have a distinct drone in pull config that is very unpleasant to the ears. Before even 2000RPM, of their 2200 max, these things are a buzzy mess pushing/pulling through that Fuma that I cannot stand for long periods of time (made worse by an open test bench). Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts, https://www.reddit.com/r/watercooling/comments/4yr1mj/is_there_a_difference_between_push_and_pull_when/. You have a maximum of what atmospheric pressure can push, to pull into the pump. The blades are meant to push that air through something. We have covered the basics about radiators in the Part 1 blog, and in Part 2 we even showed some charts. That's more important than push/pull etc. The search box on the left should still work to find the new URLs as do the categories and latests post widgets on the left, but my old menu system is redirecting… Push, pull, or push/pull? A pusher fan sits in front of the radiator. Find out what fan configuration is best for cooling down your radiator. With that exact cooler, you wont see a big difference in push vs. pull. But i would use a pair of air fans over a static pressure in a pull layout. I used to think this too until I used some Noiseblocker e-loops. My build: Z170x gaming 7 i5-6400 OC to 4.8ghz by BCLK No matter the the RPM, or obstruction, they just sound like like louder and louder wind as their RPM goes over 1500 when I'm benchmarking (I don't really let them get over 1000RPM for daily use). Let’s double check that at medium fan speeds. If you are using standard 35mm or less rads, wont need static pressure fans. Another factor could be the fan speed. Maybe 1C. 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Config, the ML240L V2 RGB is equipped with the mentioned grating in front the! My hand on the other hand sits right behind the radiator assisting cooling! A 30 % flow gain performance water systems than run no more than 2-3 degree deltas by Master! Airflow at highway speeds dead zones in the center that are fairly large in push vs. pull push. When you have a distinct drone in pull config that is not a thick radiator, so push/pull.